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As of Tuesday, August 7, 2012
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It is much easier to show support by either boycotting or supporting Chic-Fil-A than actually doing something that will make a difference in the community or world. Why not take that chicken sandwich and giving it to someone in need.
If you want to make a difference how about boycotting the oil companies who stone homosexuals in their county. I guess that would be too much of an inconvenience.
Boycotting serves no purpose today in the 21st century. Like unions, boycotting had it's benefits in years past, but it is silly in today's day and age.
Has anyone ever told you that you bear a striking resemblance to Steve Jobs?
It's really quite uncanny.
psssstt......maybe cuz it is a pic of Jobs?
What's pathetic is when a Christian businessman who stands up for his beliefs is lambasted by the liberal media and by mayors in cities that are overrun by crime and perversion. What is even more pathetic is that the only people who are not supposed to voice their opinions are those with Christian and Biblical beliefs. That's what the chicken sandwich was all about and if it would help get our country on the right path (which it will not), I would eat chicken sandwiches three times a day every day. The only thing that is going to accomplish that is lots and lots of prayer and going to the polls and voting the current administration out of office.
And Albany isn't overrun with crime and perversion? That's almost laughable. Are you aware of the number of children born to unwed mothers in this area? Of the number of violent as well as non-violent crime here? Last time I checked, your God was no more a fan of adultery, promiscuity or wearing clothing of mixed fibers than he was of homosexuality. And South Georgia is certainly not short on churches. No one said Christians don't have a right to speak their mind. As far as prayer goes, it doesn't work. Don't believe me? Pray for someone with Down's Syndrome to be healed and see what happens. Pray for someone with a completely severed spinal cord to walk again and see what happens.
As a parent with a child with Downs Syndrome, your example is offensive. I'm pretty sure that you don't care, but, every post you make seems to include that reference. Can you find something else to obsess on other than whether or not MY God answers prayer or not? (He does, despite your objections)
Yes, there are other examples: amputees, people with completely severed spinal cords, basically anything that would violate the laws of nature. In any such case the results of prayer are always the same, the condition will not change. No matter who prays, no matter how earnestly, no matter how humbly. I'm curious. Why is pointing out that Down's Syndrome can't be cured by prayer offensive? I have a cousin with Down's Syndrome by the way. He's a great guy and a lot of fun to spend time with.
You may be right. I've been praying that you will stop being such a douche, but so far, no joy....
I have a child with Downs Syndrome and I can say 100% that prayer DOES work. Yes, my child still has Downs but he has overcome every thing that is put in his path. And that is ONLY because of prayer. He was born with cancer and it just poof went away...tell me that's not prayer. Yes, prayer works! God does not answer every prayer, and I don't know why but I do know that he makes no mistakes and my son is NO mistake. So, yes sir.....prayer works and my son would be dead with out it.
I think you attributing to prayer that which is really attributable to other things. It's that god doesn't answer impossible prayers (requests that would violate the laws of nature) occassionally; it's that he NEVER answers those prayers. He will NEVER heal an amputee. He will NEVER heal someone with a completely severed spinal cord.
I'm sorry BillyBob, I will include you in my prayers. I hope the imperfections of Christians will not ultimately lead your life away from saving love of Christ.
It seems to me that your problem isn't with Christianity, it is with religion. More specifically, how people have changed certain aspects of religion across the centuries. Man is inherently prone to serve his/her own selfish desires.
Like conspiracy theories, there are many people who claim they have proof that religion is made up and it is all a big hoax by the church. I am not a preacher nor do I claim to have the knowledge of an ordained minister, but I would encourage you to speak with a Christian preacher to discuss your views.
If you are right in your views, that is one thing, but what if you are wrong?
That's not necessary. I was a devout Christian for many years. Frankly, I've probably read more and studied theological subjects as much, if not more, as many ordained ministers. I did not reach my conclusion that religion is false lightly. I wouldn't say religion is a hoax. People who believe typically do so genuinely. But believers are usually indoctrinated from a very early age. It's also interesting to note that when you ask a Christian or a Muslim under what circumstance and in the presence of what evidence would you change your mind and give up your religion the answer is almost always there is no circumstance or evidence. It's not every time, but a vast majority of the time. Most atheists on the other hand when confronted with solid evidence of god's existence would change their views.
Pray for Downs Syndrome to be healed. This is far fetched. You should be praying for guidance and acceptance of what was given to you. Children of any caliber are gifts of God. How you choose to accept these gifts are up to you. You could have had a perfectly normal child and they had many emotional problems. Prayer does work, just try, but ask in the right way.
So even you acknowledge it's far fetched to pray for impossible things despite what it says in the bible. Read matthew 17:20, Matthew 21:21, mark 11:24, John 14:14, James 5:15. Those verses are very clear and unambiguous. If one prays in the manner prescribed in those verses for something that goes against the laws of nature what will happen? Nothing. Prayers are "answered" in accordance with the normal laws of probability and nature.
I worked in healthcare for 20 yrs and saw many things turn from near death to being able to leave the hospial due to people praying. Many doctors, nurses and others in the healhcare field has prayed for their patients and yes my God, your God does answer prayers. I will add you to my prayers.
Have you seen patients who did not believe and did not pray also return to health from very serious conditions? And conversely did you also see patients die who were devout believers and had scores of people praying for them? I am quite certain the answer to both questions is yes, of course. This proves that these things occur to believers and non-believers alike according to the laws of probablility. Now for the more interesting question... In your 20 year career did you ever see a patient have a limb restored? Did you ever see a patient with a completely severed spinal cord rise and walk? No, you did not. So what we see is that things that are possible you saw happen to believers and non-believers alike with and without prayer. But things that are impossible, you never saw. Because you are a believer you chose to attribute the wins for believers to prayer. The belivers who never recovered and died despite prayer, I assume you chalk up to "god's plan." It's interesting. I think you helped illustrate the point beautifully.
Albany is full of crime and perversion but at least their public officials did not state that they would use their power to keep Chik-Fil-A out of their town or run them out if they were already there. Don't you think that is an abuse of the public office they were elected too? You don't agree with my views so you can't come to my town? How juvenile and immature and intolerent is that?
That is also speech I don't agree with. So far, unless things have changed, those mayors have taken no action to inhibit Chick-fil-A from doing business. If that speech turns to action, which it rarely does in politics, those officials will find themselves on the losing end of a lawsuit as they should be. But it is no different than the Cathy family using their wealth and power to support organizations actively working to ensure gays don't get the right to get married. I think Chik-fil-A should be able to do business wherever they want and I think gays should be able to get married. Freedom for everyone.
No one is saying... Well maybe almost no one, that Mr. Cathy has a right to his openion. What the problem is his corporate support for groups that would deny civil rights to som citizens of this country.
The sandwich has nothing to do with it. The time to make the appearance is the show of support. It may be a small gesture, but it does make people feel involved. People from either side. As to boycotting the oil monarchs, it would be too inconvienant. People chose easy battles with lots of publicity available for either side.
No. The problem with boycotting the oil companies is that would address the actions of foreign nations. The gay people who are fighting for the right to get married are Americans seeking change in America. How is protesting sharia law in Saudi Arabia going to help a gay couple in Atlanta win the right to get married? Muslim countries are theocracies ruled by ancient religious law. Thankfully, we are not a theocracy here in America despite the fact that some people oppose rights for people here based on a 2000 year old collection of books that included a talking snake, talking donkey and talking shrub.
The definition of marriage being between a man and a women is not just a Christian belief. Look at the other religions in the world and NOT ONE of them approves of same sex marriage. I also believe that all of them disapprove of homosexuality. Are they all wrong? This is not about denying rights to same sex couples, this is about refusing to redefine the definition of marriage being between a man and a women. If you want to give the same tax benefits and rights to a same sex couple then call it a legal union or civil union and do not force churches to have to recognize it as marriage when it goes against their beliefs. If this is truly about "rights" and not about thumbing your nose at Christian beliefs or forcing your desire on others then that should solve the issue.
Yes and Christianity also condoned mulitple wives, concubines, rape victims marrying their rapists, etc. You contend that those things changed with the New Testament, so you acknowledge even in the bible acceptable activity evolved based on changing societies. Is it your contention that that evolution ended 2000 years ago? And you still have avoided the question: How will gays getting married affect you or your marriage?
This Chick-Fil-A "crisis" only shows how frustrated Americans really are. They are tired of constantly being battered about the values they find important. I think politicians use this as a decoy, something that takes our eyes off of what is happening on Capitol Hill. In the end, it is easier for us to take a lunch hour to support a cause then to make a long-term commitment to enact change. When the little man believes he has won a victory, he returns to his little corner of the world satisfied he did his part. Meanwhile, the wolves at Capitol Hill are going to and fro seeing who they can devour.
What change would you like to enact?
It's all about one man's opinion or personal beliefs. God gave us each the right to a personal opinion and individual beliefs. It is a shallow minded person to think it is all about a chicken sandwich. We need to get on with the business of living and doing positive things for others rather than spending our days acting silly.
God did not give us the right to our personal opinions, ask Lot's wife, she might tell you differently. God did not ever ask our opinions, because Moses disobeyed God by striking the rock instead of speaking to it. He was not allowed to go into the promise land. God also spoke on homosexuality. If we do not obey him, we will have our cross to bear. God actually told us to be silent.
So we don't have a right to an opinion if it disagrees with your religion of choice?
sounds like a dictator to me. obey or die? can god be the anti-christ?
it makes no sense to speak to a rock......unless you are in a mental institution (disclaimer: no offense to anyone in a mental institution intended)
You lost your way. God asked Moses to obey him. He went his own way and was punished. This is an example of God's power. You would know if you bothered to study the Bible. No, you are absorbed your own selves. But you will have a 1000 years to find your way after the Rapture. I just will not as well as other Christians, be around to observe it. I'll be in heaven. Woe unto you who are left!
I was a devout Christian for many years and have studied the bible extensively. In fact, if I would wager I have studied the bible more than 90 percent of Christians. I have also studied the way the bible was assembled and vetted. It is a collection of books selected by men from many books written by men that were then translated by men.
Shows how pathetic the dumb a$$ liberals are for attention. Their trying to get everyones mind off Obummas disaster of a economy.
the disaster of an economy was handed down to President Obama, he inherited it from Bush
BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA....HOHOHOHOHOHOHOHOHOHOHOHOHOHO.....ooooooooooooooo.......egad, man! That's gotten SO old...!
But still true.
He didn't INHERIT it, he campaigned FOR it!! To FIX it!!!! Supposedly, or so the story went....
Come on, spradley, the "Blame Bush" rhetoric has ran its' course. The economy was in shambles with O took office. He's has done NOTHING to make it better...only worse.
No one put a noose around Obama's neck and made him run for president. He just was not experienced enough to lead a country and stacked his close hand folks with less experience than him. So now we have this mess to contend with. BTW, he also chose to run again, so quit blaming Bush, for we were a lot better off under Bush than Obama. Wait until you get your paycheck after taxes go up.
Who did Bush inherit it from?
I was wondering how long it would be before someone blamed this on Obama. Ignorance at its best. Let's do better Albany, this is starting to be embarrassing. The same goes for WALB. Who actually monitors some of these comments?
This is Albany Herald not WALB. One thing it shows us how 2 faced Obama is, at 1st he was against gay marriage now that he thinks it will help him get reelected he's for it. I think all politicians are 2 faced.
If people can blame Bush, why can't people blame Obuma?
Wandering off the path we lose our way.
I hear a lot of quotes from the Torah. I support the Jews, but didn't know there were so many in Albany.
I have a question...why does anyone HAVE to donate to any particular organization? Just because I donate to one cause and not the other, doesn't mean I am against the one I didn't give money to. It means I have limited extra funds, and I chose the one that means the most to me.
Who said you HAVE to? I only give to those I WANT to and you may be surprised at the organizations I REFUSE to even give a penny to and the ones I am happy to DONATE to.
Cliff Notes: Dan Cathy; a generous man, CEO of Chick-Fil-A, and a known Christian answers a reporters question with the Earth-shaking response that he supports traditional marriage and not gay marriage. The left goes berserk and the press wails on his business. Christians who are usually silent, patronize his business on Aug 1st in large numbers as a peaceful show of support. This enrages leftists, especially when compared to their own weak showing for a counter-protest.
Heterophobic Christian-haters post comments blaming those who supported the Cathy's for: spewing hatred, the rise in crime, teen pregnancies, Down's syndromes, etc.
Where are those comments? Because I haven't seen one person who has blamed the Cathy's for any of the things you mentioned.
Your complaint isn't with the Dan Cathy. All he did was answer a question. I'm not sure its really with the Christians who poured out to support him when he was attacked. Your beef seems to be with God. You'll have to work that out with him. But Christian-bashing is fun sport isn't it? It's really easy because Christians are sinners too. Well. Continue having fun.
It's not bashing. It's trying to present a different point of view. I don't have a beef with god as I don't believe he exists. Frankly, I don't have a problem with Christians 99 percent of the time. They are decent people trying to lead decent lives. However, from time to time, religious people try to enforce other people who are not follwers, to abide by what they think is directed by their version of god. I do have a problem with that. I have the same type of problem with that that you would probably have if Muslims wanted you to live under sharia law since you don't follow their religion. Do you see the parallels?
Careful, you're tipping the intelligence meter. The parallels are glaring but I think the glare may have blinded some here.
Parallels? You can believe in God or not. It's your choice. Be gay. Your choice again. You certainly don't need my permission. Marriage partner? Take your pick. But what seems to be intolerable is if I have a contrary opinion - especially if it is rooted in my Christian beliefs; then the response always seems to be accusations that we are hateful, bigoted, intolerant, hypocrites, idiots who believe in fairy tale talking snakes and donkeys, don't do anything to help the needy, dummies for praying for comfort to the sick and infirmed, etc. Then we get lectured about religious beliefs. You don't believe in God. We get it.
Listen to yourself dude. If my beliefs and prayers are so meaningless. Why do they bother you so much?
So you can spout your opinion and we should not do so. See the parallel?
BTW. I'm eating a Chick-Fil-A sandwich at the mall as I typed the above. I didn't do it to make a point. Just thought you'd appreciate the irony that you helped subconsciously direct me here.
Because many who share your opinion want your opinions to dictate that a segment of our population can't have the same rights as another segment of our population. When opinions turn into action that denies rights to one group that is granted to another group they cease to be only opinions and they are open to active opposition. And again, I never said anyone was hateful, bigoted, intolerant, uncharitable or unintelligent. It is my opinion that you are delusional (delusional is defined as maintaining a false belief in the face of invalidating evidence) and indoctrinated. But then again, that's only my opinion. I'm not trying to legally prohibit you from being those things. Care to answer my core question? How would gays being able to marry affect your marriage or your ability to marry?
I do NOT want to get into a pissing match with you, but really. Are you going to keep asking everyone the same old tired questions? I answered that question a few days ago and you acknowledged my answer. Are you expecting a response from everyone here? And I SO agree with the poster above. Your Down's/spinal cord meme is getting quite old, too.
Then tell me your theory as to why god doesn't heal amputees and people with Down's Syndrome despite what is in Matthew 17:20, Matthew 21:21 and the other verses I cited. The bible is very plain and clear. And yes you did answer the question Lulu. In fact, I think you were the only one. If I'm not mistaken, you and I agree that gays being able to marry would have no affect whatsoever on you marriage or ability to marry or on your right to practice your religion.
I am nowhere near qualified to answer that question. In fact, I have my own questions where the Bible is concerned. Anyway, from what you've said about your past involvement in the church, I think you know far more than I do about the Bible and God's word. But I have faith BELIEVE in God. Events in my life have assured that. I, personally, had a "burning bush" sort of experience years ago. Believe what you will. I don't care if you do or don't. But I have faith. Can I ask what happened to cause such a drastic change in you? I can understand not believing and then believing, but I can't understand believing and then not believing.
It really began with a Mormon friend of mine and me learning about things Mormons believe. I found them to be outrageous. They believe North America was once home to an ancient Jewish civilization. They believe an angel directed Joseph Smith to golden tablets in the Catskills detailing this civilization and Christ's interactions with them. They believe Joseph Smith translated these tablets by peering at a magic stone he had placed in his hat. They believe god lives on a planet called Kolob. I mean it is really some crazy stuff. But I realized I believed some pretty crazy stuff too -- just different crazy stuff. So I started looking for evidence of this crazy stuff. Surely, there must be some evidence for my faith. None of Jesus' miracles left any physical. God has never spoken or appeared to modern man. To keep this short questions led to questions. How could god allow bad things to happen to believers? Why aren't sincere prayers said in faith answered? Why would god force us to make an eternal decision in what is basically a blink of an eye here on earth? There were many others. To answer these questions and stay within the faith requires a lot of rationalization and illogical thinking. One answer though, fit every question was rational and logical. Because god is imaginary. So I started to look at the evidence that god is imaginary and it is overwhelming. Anyway, there is the Readers Digest version of why I left the faith. It would take a lot more time and space than we have here to get into the particulars.
You do not think that just our existence is evidence enough that God exists? The complex makeup of the human body, its ability to heal itself, the ecosystem as it exists, the fact that earth is the only planet with gravitational pull to keep us from floating off into space, the fact that the sun is exactly the right distance from earth to keep us alive - any closer we would burn up, any farther away we would freeze to death? Surely you cannot believe that we came from nothing. In my opinion, that is a greater leap of faith than believing that God exists.
Why should god be the explanation for those things? And why the Christian god? The odds are good that there is life on another planets any way. Our sun is one star of billions of stars in one galaxy of billions of galaxies. You seem to be advocating the god of the gaps arguement. The problem with this argument for believers is that as science fills in the gaps with actual scientific answers to questions, as they have done over the centuries, there are fewer gaps to fill.
Let's assume for the moment there is life on other planets or in other galaxies of which we have no knowledge. No one can definitively say that there isn't, so the possibility exists. Unfortunately, this does not answer the primary question - If there is no God then how did life begin, where did the galaxies come from, and how were things set up just perfectly to sustain life on earth? By chance, by randomness? There is no life on Mars, Jupitor, the moon, only Earth. At some point the universe as we know it was created which means that there has to be a power higher than ourselves that could create the stars, planets, galaxies, universe and life from nothing.
Perhaps god has a reason for not healing amputees. Look at that guy at the Olympics. He doesn't have his full legs, but it did not stop him from his dream of competing in that race at the olympics. No he didn't come close to winning, but I was very impressed with his performance. No doubt he could easily outrun me and I have both of my legs. He wasn't feeling sorry for himself. Perhaps god showed him he can still live a life without his full legs. Perhaps that was god's message to this brave athlete.
What affects my marriage is neither the acid test nor germane to the issue. But to answer your question, gays do not affect my marriage nor ability to marry. Someone else's necrophilia doesn't affect it either, but I still reserve the right to harbor a contrary opinion. The Nazi party and the New York Yankees don't affect my marriage either, but I can still refuse to cheer for them. As I said before. Gays certainly don't need my consent or approval to marry. But I will continue to love my gay friends and believe that homosexuality is wrong, because my God said so. We have all lied or stolen during our lives at some point. We have all sinned. How does my religious belief that marriage only truly occurs between a man and a woman, affect your marriage or ability to marry?
Thank you for helping me prove my point. Gays being able to marry will have zero effect on you, your marriage, your ability to practice your religion. You don't have to believe that gays are married in the religious sense if you don't want to. Just allow them the same LEGAL rights that you enjoy. Religion should not be a part of the legal aspect of marriage. I think it's good and right and just that gays be allowed to marry just like heterosexual couples. I also think it's good and right and just for you to disapprove of their lifestyle. Equal freedom for everyone.
I agree with all of that except for the the equal freedom part, and never stated differently. It has nothing at all to do with freedom. Yet because I will not embrace or condone their gay conduct, it will still be said that I as a Christian fought to deny them some "right". Now. Who will you next defend? Pedophiles? The Man/boy association? Under your logic, don't they have rights too?
What a terrible comparison. We're talking about conduct between two mentally competent adults. You're bringing up child molesters. Let's leave the pedophilia to the church.
So only clergy commits pedophelia? And you accuse me of making a terrible comparison? So what about necrophelia? One consenting adult and one corpse. It doesn't affect my marriage. Should I embrace his "right" to conduct himself that way? Would I be impinging on his "freedom" if I disagreed with it or opined that my religious beliefs teach against such conduct? Will you defend his personal choice?
Cartman...don't argue with billybob...it will only fustrate you. I tried it not too long ago. He is not going to see your point, no matter what you say.
Actually I will acknowledge a good point counter to my opinions. I did on a thread yesterday as a matter of fact. The problem is cartman hasn't made a good point yet. His strawman arguements are weak and intellectually dishonest.
I know he is being obtuse. I'm not getting frustrated. Folks like BB have a right their opinion too.
You didn't like my jab at the Catholics? Hey you set it up, I just knocked it down. How am I supposed to resist that fast ball down the middle? As I'm sure you know necrophelia is also just as illegal as child molestation. Bestiality is too, just in case that was your next strawman.
The jab didn't bother me a bit. So "legality" is now the test? Homosexuality used to be illegal. In fact, I think sodomy laws are still on the books. Just not enforced. Social norms change. God does not. But you tell me. What am I allowed to agree with and with what am I allowed to disagree? Because all that started this storm was Dan Cathy personally not agreeing with gay marriage. For that he has been demonized. Were you outraged at Obama for stating that same position up until a few months ago?
Actually, I think the comments led to people looking in to the financial support The Cathy's give to groups that are actively trying to prevent homosexuals from getting the right to marry. I may be wrong, but I haven't really heard a whole lot of people saying he shouldn't have the right to say what he wants. By the way, I ate at chick-fil-a Saturday. They do make one heckuva a chicken sandwich.
The Cathys have been openly Christian since the beginning of their company. They are known as the company that doesn't open on Sundays. They didn't just start taking a Christian position on homosexuality. And there is not one instance of any discrimination towards gays. They do a lot for their young employees like scholarships and such. I guess the Christian show of support was because this generous family was felt to be undeservedly bashed for some pretty mainstream views.
I've got to leave the keyboard, so I'll concede the rest of the evening to you. Have a nice one.
billybob......i agree with you...i have my opinion on god too...now don't question me, or bug me....leave me alone.......remember i am entitled to my opinion just as everyone else is..if one has formed an opinion is it really going to do any good and is it really anyone's business for others to hound the person constantly about the fact that they disbelieve in a god? i am thrilled for those who believe in prayer and when my religious friends tell me they pray for me or have their church pray for me i don't get upset and go into a rant and act like they do when they find out i am not a believer and feel the need to try to convert me and tell me of the wonders of jesus christ......and to borrow from good ole tywebb..."it's all about one man's opinion or personal beliefs and we each own the right to a personal opinion and those individual beliefs. we need to get on with the business of living and doing positive things for others rather than spending our days arguing about who is right. seems to me we are all right in our individual belief." (sorry tywebb but you said it so well i had to borrow the thought and rearrange it a bit...you said it so much better than i could have...hope you don't mind..wanted to make sure that credit was given where credit was due.)
Don't ever minimize the value of speaking out in support of your values. Just as our bodies are strengthened by exercise so our freedoms are strengthened by the exercise of them.
When Dan Cathy expresses his opinion he will be able to find out whether the Constitution is still applicable and if he is still free.
Okay, for billybob's sake lets step away from the Bible and just use Websters dictionary as our reference book. Nature : the physical universe and the laws and forces that govern changes within it. Perverse: willfully doing what is wrong or unreasonable. Marriage : the institution under which a man and a woman become legally united on a permanent basis. We all are born with imperfections according to what " society" deems as ideal. Some of these imperfections are physical, some mental. Those born with physical imperfections battle with them all their lives. We are also born with mental tendencies that we also have to battle with. Some win these battles and some tragically lose. Intellect and reason do not explain homosexuality. The law of nature has been broken by those who can't or won't fight these tendencies. The rest of us know what our personal imperfections are . I hope , for the sake of the world, we don't give in to them.
Break, timeout. The constituition is the main concern, freedom of speech, expression and choice. I choose not to be a right winger, they all think the same. Just read their post.
Okay, back to playing cards with the Coach. Retirement from you guys is GOOD!
The Real Semi-Retired Deal
You Jokers don't know Jack. Can't tell a King from a Queen!